Monday, February 19, 2007

Is San Diego's Gay Community Experiencing God's Judgment - Violence, Disease & Death Overwhelming Local Gay Community

A James Hartline Report Exclusive
- On The Frontlines Of The Culture War -
February 20, 2007

Is San Diego's Gay Community Experiencing God's Judgment?
Tremendous Surge Of Violence, Disease and Death Overwhelms Community
As Gay Leaders Continue Promoting Pornography and Attacks on Christians

JHReport - According to a recent Newsweek poll, 92% of Americans believe in God ( How each American reflects their respective belief in God seems to ebb and flow with the various troubles in the culture at the time. Prior to the 9/11 attacks, church attendance and growth was fairly stagnant in America. One well-known minister in San Diego, California, has stated that his congregation's attendance jumped considerably after the World Trade Center catastrophe in 2001. However, he emphasizes that the upsurge in church attendance was shortlived. Shortly after the dark and fearful days of 9/11, church attendance at many local churches returned to pre-9/11 numbers.

Many Americans will not give any credence to what the Bible says regarding God's laws or the consequences for rebelling against God's established order and commandments. What would happen if an entire community rebelled against God and decided to make all of their decisions based upon a godless/secular ideology? Does the Bible warn America about taking such a path? It now appears that one San Diego community is finding out just what happens when they make such a decision.

Hillcrest is a mid-size community in the city of San Diego, California. Known for its ethnic restaurants and lavicious hair salons, Hillcrest is ground zero for much of San Diego's gay activism. It is also a neighborhood that has cast aside all Biblically-based values for a moral compass that is set by the minds of those who think they can do without any laws based upon traditional American values. What are the consequences for Hillcrest when the neighborhood's moral directions are controlled by a homosexual population that moved in and took over the community two decades ago? The following story will paint a far different picture then the positive one often portrayed by local gay-friendly media outlets. In fact, things are so different that many concerned citizens may be moved to ask themselves, "Is God's judgment underway in Hillcrest?"

Hillcrest: A Community In Chaos

American citizens find no pleasure in the demise of any group of people. Throughout its long and storied history, America's brave military, with the backing of its national citizenry, has sacrificed great amounts of its own blood to save other nations, communities and movements. The compassion of America seems to know no bounds. In fact, most men and women who are incarcerated in American prisons are compassionately treated better than most of the law-abiding citizens living in the foreign countries liberated by U.S. soldiers.

What you are about to read is the tale of an American community that threw away traditional norms. It is the story of an American homosexual stronghold in San Diego, California called Hillcrest. From daily attacks on Christianity to promoting pornography among young teenagers, Hillcrest's gay population has rejected all Biblical values which have been the driving force behind America's greatness. Gay sex clubs, pornographic book stores and social service centers promoting homosexuality now outnumber churches and schools in Hillcrest. You will almost never find a practitioner of homosexuality or lesbianism in the Hillcrest area who will criticize the sexual anarchy that has taken over this once conservative military neighborhood. The consequences for a community that has embraced a radical ideology of sexual anarchy and self-endulgence is beginning to become very clear. For the outside observer who looks into the heart and soul of Hillcrest, a fatalistic portrait of a neighborhood bent on self-extermination is being revealed.

While the vast majority of Hillcrest's gay population rejects the Bible, it may prove useful to them to at least consider what the Bible has to say about the self-destructive choices they are making. The Book of Deuteronomy reveals the high cost to a community or group of people who reject God's commandments and laws:

"But if you refuse to listen to the Lord your God and do not obey all the commands and laws I am giving you today, all of these curses will come and overwhelm you: You will be cursed with confusion and disillusionment in everything you do, until at last you are completely destroyed for doing evil and forsaking me. The Lord will send diseases among you until none of you are left in the land you are about to enter and occupy. The Lord will strike you with wasting disease, fever, and inflammation. These devastations will pursue you until you die. The Lord will cause you to be defeated by your enemies. You will be oppressed and robbed continually, and no one will come to save you." Deuteronomy Chapter 28

Is Hillcrest suffering the judgment that God says in Deuteronomy will occur for rejecting His laws? You be the judge as you read the sad tale of Hillcrest's demise.

1997: The Year of Cunanan's Hell

If ever there was a human face that revealed the darker spiritual dynamics that permeate the landscape of the modern homosexual movement in America, then that face belongs to Andrew Cunanan. In 1997, America was terrorized by Andrew Cunanan, a male prostitute turned serial killer. Cunanan called the San Diego gay community of Hillcrest his home turf. Fearing that he had been infected with the AIDS virus during his long and twisted involvement with the homosexual S & M leather community, Cunanan went into a calamitous tailspin in 1997. That year, Cunanan's insidious slide into insanity took a hellish turn resulting in the murder of five men. At the end of Cunanan's unhappy gay life, he committed suicide aboard a Miami houseboat. (

During Cunanan's murder spree, the nation was rivited on San Diego, California. When news reporters began to question residents of Hillcrest, the public quickly learned just how much fear was festering in the hearts of San Diego's gay and lesbian community. Once national news sources reported on Cunanan's suicide, fear turned back to the routine preoccupation with sexual gratification that guides a great deal of momentum within Hillcrest's social dynamic.

Pulpits throughout America have issued warning after warning about the consequences for engaging in homosexuality. Members of San Diego's homosexual population have heard it all: the early death, the disease, the oppression, all to no avail. For over two decades, Christian leaders have been pleading with political leaders to put a stop to the insidious quest by gay activists who are seducing America's youth into experimenting with homosexuality, lesbianism and transsexualism. Not only have such pleadings and warnings fallen on deaf ears, but extremely liberal politicians have partnered with gay activists to create laws allowing these same gay activists to have full acess to America's youth for indoctrination purposes.

There was a time in the United States when the drive to indoctrinate America's youth into embracing homosexuality was being restricted to sex education programs within the public educational system. Those days are over. San Diego, California is perhaps one of the clearest examples of just how bad the hostile takeover of America's youth by radical gay activists has become. Just eight years after the Andrew Cunanan killing spree, the San Diego Gay Pride organization became embroiled in one of the biggest sexual predator scandals in American history. After a lengthy investigation by the James Hartline Report in 2005, the world learned that the San Diego Gay Pride organization had hired at least five dangerous registered sex offenders to work or volunteer for its 2005 gay pride festival and parade. One of those offenders was Martin Ramirez, a pedophile who peforms under the name "Marty the Clown". Ramirez was hired that year to perform in the San Diego Gay Pride Children's Garden where he entertained children as young as two years of age. Shockingly, this was not the first year that Ramirez had been hired for that position (;bp=t).

The 2005 San Diego Gay Pride/Pedophile scandal was so horrific that for the first time in eleven years the San Diego City Council did not issue a citywide proclamation to honor the annual pornographic parade and festival ( Americans held their collective breaths in anticipation that the San Diego Gay Pride organization would make the changes necessary to protect children from the pornography and male prostitution that is regularly promoted during the event each year. America's collective breath was quickly exhaled in 2006, as it was made clear that the organization was more determined than ever to continue its drive to pursue further involvement of youth in their pornographic events.

During the San Diego City Council hearing on July 25, 2006, over 90 gay activists and their supporters showed up to influence the council's decision to issue a proclamation to honor the San Diego Gay Pride organization and its annual events. Rather than acknowledge the terrible decisions that the group had made the previous year when San Diego Gay Pride had hired the network of sex offenders, the multitude of gay activists used the city council hearing to lambast Christians opposed to the pornographic gay pride events. In speech after speech, gay and lesbian gay pride promoters attacked Christians and their beliefs. It had now become perfectly clear that there would be no repentence on the part of those gay leaders who have been so determined to continue their rabid quest to indoctrinate San Diego's youth into their crusade of sexual anarchy.

You can watch the San Diego Gay Pride city council hearing from July 25, 2006 by logging onto the San Diego City Council website: and Click VIEW VIDEO on July 25, 2006.

Several days later, the San Diego Gay Pride Festival turned from a celebration of homosexuality and pornography into a tragic blood bath as several gay males were severely beaten outside of the gay pride festival grounds ( The assaults were so severe that one of the victims, Oscar Foster, remained in intensive care for two weeks due to a fractured skull and mutilple facial injuries. Baseball bats and a knife were used in the horrific attacks. James Allen Carroll received eleven years in prison for attempted murder on the victims after accepting a plea bargain with prosecutors. Two other adult attackers also received lengthy prison terms for their roles in the heinous attacks.

Following the horrific gay pride festival beatings, San Diego's homosexual community responded with a massive rally in support of the six men who were beaten. Hundreds turned out for the rally in Hillcrest ( During the rally, calls for increased promotion of hate crimes legislation were followed by the presentation of a $35,000 check from the Gay and Lesbian Center to alledgely be used to stop crimes they deemed to be instigated by hate.

The violence erupting out of the 2006 Gay Pride festival was a continuation of what has now become a long and dark period of chaos inside of San Diego neighborhoods where homosexuality is being promoted and embraced ( According to a November 9, 2006 Gay and Lesbian Times article, the violence in the Hillcrest area has become so bad that 33 robberies occurred during a recent ninety-day period of time in the neighborhood ( The Gay and Lesbian Center, one of the biggest proponents of the pornographic businesses in the Hillcrest area, claims that the number of victims could be much higher due to active military members who may not report being robbed out of fear they would be kicked out of the military for being involved in homosexuality.

Recognizing the severity of the violent war that has now spread throughout these areas, Lesbian Councilwoman Toni Atkins has begun supporting the formation of Stonewall Citizen's Patrol, a homosexual civilian neighborhood watch group. While Atkins and other homosexual leaders are at the ready to defend San Diego's gay neighborhoods from further attacks, there is virtually nothing being said about the continuous immoral campaign against young teens by pornographers inside of the San Diego Gay Pride events. Further hypocrisy surrounding this crisis is demonstrated by the attacks launched almost daily by San Diego gay activists against Christians and Catholic causes (

One of the most putrid examples of local gay attacks on religious enterprises can be seen coming from a group calling itself the "Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence". The Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence is an organization that includes men who dress up as Catholic Nuns and who perform some of the most vile and disgusting acts imaginable. Last year, the group could be seen marching in the San Diego Gay Pride Parade ( While most Christians and Catholics consider the actions of the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence to be blasphemous, the San Diego Gay Pride organization fully accepts the group's immoral behavior. In doing so, leaders of the San Diego Gay Pride and the homosexual community's leaders have completely rejected any of the Bible's condemnation for such acts.

While there may not be any apparent moral conviction for embracing such anti-christian discrimination, is it possible that these same gay leaders will ever consider that their actions are reaping a judgment from God on their community? Is it actually possible that God is angry with their mockery of the Bible that has become a cornerstone of the gay community in San Diego? If so, will there be any reconsideration by San Diego's gay community for their anti-god, anti-christian behaviors? Is Hillcrest being warned by God? What will happen if they don't heed such warnings?

Although leaders of the San Diego homosexual movement have rejected any Biblical references to homosexuality and lesbianism as being a sin, perhaps it is time for them to rethink their conclusions. The Bible teaches a premise that the wages for sin include death. While most in the gay community reject that premise, is it possible, that in doing so, they could be wrong? Is it possible that God does judge those that harm children? Is it possible that God is now judging San Diego's homosexual community for its continued promotion of rebellion against the Bible?

The following timeline report just might move some of San Diego's gay activists and their governmental partners to reconsider their conclusions about the Bible. Maybe, just maybe, they will ask themselves this very serious question:

"Has God Begun To Judge San Diego's Gay Community?"

A Shocking Timeline Report of San Diego Gay Community Trajedies.

2006: The Year of the Mocker - The Year of Violence

One of the most vocal mockers of Christianity in San Diego is gay activist and transvestite Nicole Murray Ramirez. Ramirez is a disturbing example of the terrible hypocrisy that reigns in San Diego's city hall. Ramirez is a male transvestite who dresses up as a Catholic Nun to mock the Catholic Church. When he is not calling bingo numbers at a gay bar called Bourbon Street, Ramirez is promoting xxx gay pornography and gay male nudist contests ( In one of the great immoral charades in California, Ramirez is a member of the San Diego Police Department's Gay and Lesbian Advisory Board. Additionally, while Ramirez is constantly launching attacks against Christians who oppose the gay agenda, he has been given the chairmanship of San Diego's Human Relations Commission where he is alledgedly fighting discrimination in the city (

Ramirez perhaps best defines the confusion that runs rampant in San Diego's civic affairs. In a city that has recently seen three city councilmen indicted for taking bribes from a strip club owner, San Diego is also proving to be a fertile environment for the tragic events occuring inside of its local gay community. Here are just a few of the horrible crimes and tragedies that have occurred in recent times in San Diego's gay community:

DIED: Mandy Schultz, 33, former executive director of San Diego Gay Pride, from injuries sustained in an apparent car accident. She had been missing for five weeks when her body and wrecked car were found October 29, 2001 outside of San Diego.

RESIGNED: Valerie Stallings, a longtime friend of the San Diego gay community, resigns from City Council after being found guilty of misdemeanor offenses of accepting gifts from the owner of the Padres ball team and not reporting them on her taxes. Nine years earlier Stallings defeated anti-gay councilman Bruce Henderson.

DIED: Ernest Green, a member of the Board of the Gay and Lesbian Center and a well-known local transvestite entertainer using the name of Cherie, dies of a heart attack shortly after performing in a benefit drag show at the Hole, a gay bar in the Loma Portal area of San Diego. The show is a fundraiser for the Harvey Milk/Tom Homann Student Scholarship.

ABUSED: More than 200 gay and lesbian youth aged 14 to 24 attend “The Other Prom,” the annual dance held at the Gay and Lesbian Center to promote homosexuality among young teenagers. Students from high schools throughout San Diego are encouraged to come to this dark event in Hillcrest.

DIED: The owner of two porn-promoting gay businesses, Club Montage and Rebar, John McCusker, 31, dies suddenly of cardiac arrest in 2005. His death makes national news when the Catholic bishop of San Diego refuses his family the right to have a Catholic funeral mass in any Catholic church in San Diego diocese. McCusker funded many groups which indoctrinate youth into accepting homosexuality at the same time that he allowed his business to be used for the gay porn industry. The autopsy report revealed that McCusker had ingested large amounts of amphetamines and oxycontin and alcohol.

FIRED: A 22 year-old camp intern, Joan MacQueen, at the Cuymaca Outdoor School in Descanso is fired in 2005 for discussing and promoting lesbianism with sixth grade little girls.

ATTACKED: August 21, 2006 - Double-barrel shotgun pulled on lesbian in Ocean Beach and three more crimes against gay men reported in Hillcrest, North Park area.

DIED: June 19, 2005 - Male transvestite Patricio Gonzalez died after injecting industrial silicone into his body at a San Diego gay "pumping party". Silicone is injected into males to give them "female" attributes when they are trying to impersonate women. The silicone supplier is still on the run from law enforcement.

ATTACKED: February 15, 2006 - Matthew James Witt was charged with mayhem and assault after stabbing Danny Player outside of Hamburger Mary's, a homosexual restaurant and gay bar in Hillcrest.

DIED: December 30, 2005 - Scott Alan Wood, age 42, drowned in the middle of the night at Club San Diego, a gay sex club in the heart of Hillcrest.

DIED: February 1, 2005 - Maria Plesencia was found dead in her home from a diabetic coma. Only 46 years of age, Plesencia was a feminist activist and executive vice-president of the radical homosexual group, the San Diego Democratic Club.

FIRED: July, 2006 - Five registered sex offenders, including pedophile Marty the Clown, are eventually fired from the San Diego Gay Pride organization after national outrage forced the group to take action. For weeks, San Diego Gay Pride refused to get rid of the sex offenders, and it was only after their parade and festival were almost cancelled that they finally conceded.

DIED: November 17, 2005 - Vanessa Facen, a male living as a female, died inside of a San Diego jailhouse after numerous violent outbursts against the San Diego Police Department. On Nov. 17th, San Diego sheriff's deputies found Facen naked and completely covered in blood at a Spring Valley home. After being released from a local hospital, Facen's violence again landed him in custody where he later died.

DISEASE OUTBREAK: November 10, 2005 - Syphillis rates skyrocket in San Diego's gay community. Robert Gunn, STD control officer for San Diego County’s Health and Human Services Agency, said San Diego most likely has surpassed 2004’s rate with 212 cases estimated for 2005, representing a 56 percent increase from last year. He attributed the syphilis rate increase to more and more HIV-positive men having unprotected sex with each other.
“They’re doing unprotected sex because they figure they got HIV. ‘[They say] so what’s the big deal? What can I get now?’” Gunn said.

METH EPIDEMIC: October 12, 2005 - Town hall meeting held at the San Diego Gay and Lesbian Center to address what the Gay and Lesbian Times called, "Crystal meth wreaks havoc on GLBT community," in a late 2005 article.

VIOLENCE IN GAY COMMUNITY: September 22, 2005 - Gay and Lesbian Times reports that Douglas Pastor, a Hillcrest resident, reached a settlement in a civil trial where he was seeking damages from a beating by local musician Raymond Mawhinney. Pastor's injuries included a broken jaw, broken nose and a crushed right cheekbone.

DRUG OVERDOSE: July 17, 2005 - Paramedics and San Diego Police were called to Club San Diego, a Hillcrest gay sex club where they retrieved a 25 year-old male wearing only a white towel at 2:29am. The male appeared to have overdosed on drugs and was rushed to an area hospital and later released. No police report was filed.

HILLCREST MALE DANCER ARRESTED: June 14, 2004 - Keven Lee Graff, a former marine turned gay escort and stripper was arrested for beheading screenwriter Robert Lees and stabbing to death Dr. Morley Engelson. Lees worked on such films as Abbott and Costello Meet Frankenstein. Graff was featured on a 2002 cover of the Gay and Lesbian Times when the publication featured an article on the gay circuit party scene. Graff was a mainstay in the San Diego gay bar scene where he worked as an exotic dancer.

Hillcrest: On The Verge Of Self-Extermination

No one will take pleasure in the great demise of the community of Hillcrest. It's own self-destruction over the past several years leaves most observers trying to find someway of addressing the real insanity and self-extermination that has overtaken San Diego's gay community. Most elected officials have used San Diego's gay community like a political prostitute. After getting votes and money, elected officials have paid Hillcrest's gay leaders with special rights, privileges and their very own annual gay pride porn festival. Yet, when it has come to picking up the discarded pieces from the community's crazed war against its own citizen's, these Hillcrest political "johns" are nowhere to be found.

While leaders of the gay community have routinely mocked and attacked Christians for standing up to the homosexual socialistic agenda, they may find out one day that it is those same Christians who are the only ones with real concern for the damage that San Diego's gay activists have tragically inflicted upon themselves and their community.
*Photos in this article are of gay San Diego serial killer Andrew Cunanan, Hillcrest male dancer turned killer Keven Graff, and gay pride attempted murder James Allen Carroll

This exclusive article has been provided by The James Hartline Report.
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James Hartline, Publisher
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zazzi said...

You used an extract from Deuteronomy in this post condemning homosexuality.
Deuteronomy 24, verses 1 and 2:

When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house.
And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.

Are you going to listen to everything Deuteronomy says?

James Hartline said...

Thank your for commenting and asking a respectful question. I get a lot of very terrible and profane questions and I do not allow those to be posted. Even if someone disagrees with my perspective and, I theirs, if they will simply be respectful, then I will approve their posts. Your question is very respectfully made and I really appreciate that.

As to my answer to your question:
I believe that the entire Bible is inspired by God and written by man as God's Spirit moved them to write. God wanted to reveal Himself to all generations, past, present and future through the written word that it my be passed on. This was God's decision. Thus, He filled certain men with His presence to move them to write what He wanted us to know. We cannot know everything about God until we reach heaven, but we do have this confidence that everything He wanted humanity to know, He conveyed through the written word of God.

I believe all truth for humanity is revealed in His word, so yes, I listen to everything and accept everything that is written in Deuteronomy.

Two things that are very important when trying to understand the word of God. One, you must believe that it is the word of God. And two, you must be filled with His Holy Spirit to understand the Bible. The mysteries conveyed through the word of God are only understood spiritually; in fact, the word of God says that wisdom from above is spiritually discerned.

So, if a person is not born again, filled with the Holy Spirit, that person will read the word of God and miss a good portion of what the Lord is saying to us spiritually, for the unsaved person will attempt to understand the Bible through their intellect. That intellect can be corrupted with the world's way of thinking and thus, not correctly understand the way God thinks and the way God explains things in His world. The Bible says that the things of God are foolish to the carnal person.

There are many Old Testament laws regarding cleanliness, eating of certain foods and planting crops that were applied to the health needs of ancient Israel. These sanitary laws kept them alive through harsh, unsanitary conditions.

The laws pertaining to their relationship with God Himself are eternal. They cannot be done away with because we are in eternal relationship with Him. Thus laws regarding sexuality in the Old Testament are still applicable in the New Testament. The Bible says that God does not change and He is not a man that He should lie.

Homosexuality was always considered an abomination in the eyes of God from the very beginning. Homosexuality did not exist in Heaven prior to the creation of mankind. Satan was thrown out of heaven for rebellion against God, having led 1/3 of all the angels to turn away from God and lust after Lucifer's lies. When satan was cast down to the earth, it was his scheme to cause men and women to turn from God just like he baited the fallen angels to do.

When people engage in sexual sins, they grieve the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit departs from them. It is at that place that satan can then lure mankind, void of God's presence, into any number of defiling sexual acts. When men and women engaging in homosexuality it satan throwing back at God's face a rebellious created race that God had orignally created for His pleasure.

Satan is, in most cases, able to entice men and women to engage in homosexuality because they have terible wounds that have be inflicte upon them. Wounds caused by abuse, rape, rejection, incest, etc. are places that demonic forces seek to feed on and infiltrate the mind of the victim. Sexually corrupt demonic forces then gain access to the mind where they can control it and put the person in terrible confusion and sexual deviancy. Only when the wound is healed can that place of sexual entrapment and bondage be cleansed and the person liberated. That is why I am free today from any homosexual desires. The wounds inflicted upon me as a child are healed and satan has no place in mind to control my sexual desires. I have crucified my flesh with Christ and I can now walk in truly joyous freedom and liberty, free of the torments that homosexuality creates.

Remember God said in Genesis, let Us create man (man and woman) in our image. In satan's anger for being rejected from his previous throne in heaven, satan wants to pollute the image of mankind so that when it is reflected back to God, He sees a corrupted and immoral reflection. It is satan's way of getting revenge.

God condemned homosexuality in the Bible, I did not. His grace, has provided us a way to get out from that condemnation and ultimately, eternal judgment. Remember, God says in His word, "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believe in Him, shall not perish, but have everlasting life."

It says, whosoever believes...If we believe, then we demonstrate that belief by our actions. We humble ourselves and turn from our wicked ways. If we don't crucify our sexual desires on the cross and turn our minds, our wills and our hearts over to God's purposes, then we are saying we really don't believe in God or His plans.

I turned from my very wicked ways, I am living proof that the most wretched of sinners, can get out of homosexuality, if we choose to.

In today's culture, there are many voices telling us to stay in homosexuality and embrace it. There are even teachers who have come up with a new teaching that you can be gay and Christian. That is not in the Bible. That is a lie. Who are we going to believe on the matter: the Bible or a homosexual who claims to have some new revelation. I would not want to place my entire eternal life on that false teaching. What a terrible, terrible error that is to make.

I am proof that you can get out of homosexuality. Anyone can, if following God's destiny for one's life becomes a higher calling then fulfilling the temporary lusts of the flesh.

Anonymous said...

Why aren't you pointing out the millions of Christians attacking and killing homosexuals around the country? Are that most most of the time (I'm not saying this about all Christians) gays are the one being attacked by the Christains?

I'm sorry sir, but if you intend to write such things try saying both sides of the story.

Anonymous said...

I think it stands to reason that Christ himself had his own born again experience, and thus preached that someone might want to be born again.

However I think that using that particular term for something that's much more complex and beautiful bastardizes the responsibilty of people to see it happen in their day to day life.

Think about this, Jesus went out into the desert for 40 days and 40 nights and was tempted by the devil to take advantage of his horrible god powers that he could have used to enslave the entire human race with an iron fist of awesomeness, and yet he didn't.

What he chose to do was deny those things that could have harmed all man kind, and thus by establishing a pattern of behavior contrary to what would be easy for him to do in order to bring about the Kingdom, I believe that was his instance where he was born again.

Think about it, your told from childhood your the son of God, and maybe just maybe you spent part of that childhood bringing geckos back from the dead or something and watched your parents be ostracized by the Jewish community which had strong legalistic elements spread throughout their social hierarchy, because you were born out of wedlock. Which btw that sort of treatment Jesus' family most likely suffered is probably falling under the same category of behavior your discrimination against gays happens to.

If I were Jesus, )statements like that should be totally OK because if Jesus was GOd and man, then God meant that man should relate to him with phrases like the one I just used) I would have wanted and longed to do something to change that with so much of my heart, I'd want to bring about the Kingdom of God by my own hands to see my parents and my life vindicated, but then he was baptized sent out into the desert and he comes back ready for ministry ready to give God what is God's and to never meddle with the affairs of men except through the will of the Father.

I think there was definitely moments in Jesus ministry where there weren't direct dictations from the Father to heal this person or that person, but Jesus knew of the heart of God and could work within guidelines of His intentions.

I don't think my examination and paraphrase of scripture and the motives of God are terribly far from the biblical mark, but I'll concede that some might be flimsy.

Point: being born again doesn't happen at an alter. and I guarantee, coming out of the closet or even admitting that your gay can be a moment in your life where you stop trying to cope, as Christ did perhaps, with your weakness and the sins committed against you such as discrimination or alienation, or the sins you committed to yourself, by lying about what you wanted in order to fit in. Which something Christians do all the time, I know from experience, and I've seen many of my brothers in Christ do it. But what makes that different. You confront the Truth, and the Word says that Jesus is The Truth, the Way, The Light. Those three seem synomous. Ergo, any confrontation with yourself has to be God and Jesus. And I don't God is such a dickhead that he would force us for his own sense of ego to acknowledge him by name, when we can know him more intimately through experience and being real and honest and true, with ourselves with others, bringing that Truth and Light everywhere we go by being faithful to what we are. Gay Straight, Black, White, Asian, Zebra.

Real Point: If you try and tie down what makes this faith work to a room with an alter, and a guy talking in tongues, then you've really need to explore and expand your idea about what God, and who God is. Naturally your start quoting Deuteronomy and get people all upset and angry at a group of people who just want the same thing you do, which is to be real, and honest with yourself and others and God and whoever. That means sexually, emotionally, spiritually, all of it. That's the whole human experience and when we in the Church take time to compartmentalize these aspects of humanity and put them in closets or shelves or some analogy for 'away', we do more damage to everything around us then good. Love your neighbor, Jesus said.

If you read and dealt with the bible biblically, and really respected how the forebears of scripture, (the rabbinical tradition) strove to understand or interpret scripture, you wouldn't be so willing to nail yourself to a cross of faulty logic and prejudice.